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SIPEDO SEZ

by sipedo from Brooksville, Florida

Last Post 13 hours Ago


First of all, let me preface by saying that I am not ruling out speaking in tongues, which may be the possible perception some will have.

I was born in Michigan, and my mother took us to a pentecostal church, so I grew up with speaking in tongues and just accepted it growing up. When I was old enough to understand, I began to study.  There was a difference between what I was hearing in church and what Tongues and Interpretation really are.

Today we have people in certain pentecostal circles talking about the Baptism in the Holy Spirit, and that the INITIAL EVIDENCE of the baptism is Speaking in other tongues.

Okay pentecostals, wake up.  IT does NOT say that ANYWHERE, nor is it implied ANYWHERE in the Bible.  In fact, speaking in tongues is way down the list on the gifts of importance.

Acts 1:8 says you will receive POWER (not tongues) after the Holy Spriti comes.  Power for what?  It's found in the same verse, to be witnesses.

It just so happens that when the 120 men in the upper room were filled with the Holy Spirit, they were filled with power to be witnesses.  There were people from other countries in Jerusalem at the time, and those in the upper room were given supernatural ability to speak the languages of the people who were in Jerusalem.  It was not jibberish.  God did not annoint the listeners to hear, it was real languages being spoken, proclaiming the gospel.  Those who were listening were the interpreters.

Today, speaking toungues has become an excercise in jibberish.  It has become a tool to edify oneself, and is often followed by an interpretation that is just as confusing.  How does one interpret jibberish anyway?

Now, I'm not talking about what you do in your private prayer time.  The Bible tells us very clearly that God understands our moanings and our groanings.  We don't have to have words to communicate with God, entirely.

Now, hear is a concept,  Paul wrote in I Corinthians 13 that the greatest of the gifts, is Love.  Without LOVE, everything else is in vain.  John the Apostle wrote that if you love NOT, you do not know God (I John 4:8).  We also know that in another place that says Perfect Love casts out ALL fear.  Love is POWERFUL.

It is my feeling, as of right now anyway, that the POWER that comes from the Holy Spirit, is LOVE, and that LOVE is the initial evidence of the baptism/indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Does speaking in tongues exist today?  I cannot rule it out.  God can do whatever He wants to do.  But what good is tongues in a church where EVERYONE is a BELIEVER?  The Bible clearly states that tongues is a SIGN TO THE UNBELIEVER.  Just as in that day when they began to speak in tongues, the tongues were for the UNBELIEVERS to hear the gospel in their own language.  That was the SIGN TO THE UNBELIEVER.

SO then, what good is tongues in a church service where everyone speaks only one language, ENGLISH?  It serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever.

There has been so much emphasis on speaking in tongues in pentecostal circles that it has rendered those denominations INEFFECTIVE.  What about all the other gifts that Paul writes about in I Corinthians 12 and 14?

I believe in the fullness of the gifts of the Holy Spirit.  I desire spiritual gifts.

Unlike our friends who may have graduated from colleges like Bob Jones,  I do not believe that any of the gifts have passed away.  They use the scripture in I Corinthians 13 that Tongues will  pass way.  In the same context it says Knowledge and Wisdom will pass away.

Well, if Tongues has passed away, so has knowledge, so has wisdom.  And if all that is passed, then that means we are all idiots and the only one who knows what they are talking about is northton.

Now, with this post if I have offended any who are pentecostal, GOOD.  Now at least you're thinking.

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didaskalos read my blog
Oct 23, 2008 | 9:54 AM

Wow Sip, well thought out, well said, balanced, resolute, and kind. Nice post, and I have nothing to add. I hope I didn't kill this blog with my comment ;-)

ROGER459 read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 12:49 PM

Dear "S"

• (Ephesians 5:10) Proving = what is acceptable unto the Lord.

• (1Thessalonians 5:21) Prove all things; = hold fast that which is good.

ALL Major World Religions have "Tongues" in their religious services. That is not to say ALL in Each and Every Service!

The Shinto in Japan, the Islamic in most of Asia, the African Tribal Religions, the Buddhist monks, and the list goes on and on and on!

HOW CAN THAT BE? Of course, when Experience is the motive for Truth, = = ONE will Always SUBSTITUTE = THEIR EXPERIENCE = for = "THE TRUTH!"

IS their Exotic ECSTATIC Experience = the basis for TRUTH? NOT! ... Absolutely NOT!

Perhaps... A Test??? I simply suggest = taking a Tape Recorder = and recording the SUPPOSED Holy Spirit Gift = Of Tongues = = whether a prayer language or whether used in a worship service.

SIMPLY FOLLOW THE GUIDELINES IN = = 1Corinthians 14:all

IF IT IS IN FACT = = A REAL HOLY SPIRIT GIFT == Then = ONE WHO HAS THE HOLY SPIRIT... "GIFT OF INTERPRETATION" = = CAN INTERPRET = = EITHER THE PRAYER LANGUAGE OR THE PUBLIC DEMONSTRATION = = OF SAID GIFT? ?

THAT IS WHY I SUGGESTED PRIVATE TESTING OF SAID GIFT = So that One could validate or invalidate = the Supposed GIFT?

Remember SATAN... Comes As An "Angel of Light!" See 2Corinthians 11:14 !

Thanks, Roger459.

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 1:02 PM

Thanks dida.

Now for Roger, I'm not sure where you were going with all this. It sounds like you believe that you believe in unknown tongues, and that they can be interpreted. I do not believe, in regards to tongues and interpretation, which is separate from a prayer language, will be an UNKNOWN language. I believe it will be a KNOWN language, as it was in the book of ACTS.

I am not suggesting anything about the prayer language, that is something that you do in private.

In addition, I disagree with what some teach is the INITIAL EVIDENCE. It is not tongues.

I agree with you on who Satan comes as. Satan is also a master of imitation.

ROGER459 read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 1:20 PM

Dear "S"

The Scripture is 'Complete!'

During the 'Transition Period' call forth in the Book of Acts, the SIGN GIFTS were given to the Apostles to VALIDATE their Ministries!

Even PAUL lost his Apolostic Gift of Healing as he wrote about in 2Timothy 4:20.

There is A Lot of..."Hooen & Hollerin" called Tongues!

BUT... The Command of Scripture IS SURE!

(1Corinthains 14:27) If one speaks in a language, let it be by two, or at the most three, and in succession. And let one interpret.

THIS IS NOT..."OBEYED" in Churches that practice TONGUES!

How then can DISOBEDIENCE... Be Called 'WORSHIP?'

As far as A Prayer Language, the Greek Word is the Same of Tongues..."A KNOWN LANGUAGE!"

IF.. the gift of Tongues is Really from the HOLY SPIRIT... then according to the WORD... There is ALSO ONE... who has the GIFT OF INTERPENTATION!

(1Cor 14:27) If one speaks in a language, let it be by two, or at the most three, and in succession. And let one interpret.

SATAN.... has Fooled MANY to believe in some RAMBLINGS that ARE NOT OF GOD!

Oh yes, In the Services I attened to Validat this... "How Come the Interpetation is ALWAYS IN THE... 1611 King James Version?" ... And NOT in American English?

Thanks, Roger459.

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 1:35 PM

Thanks, that was a bit clearer.

PastorD read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 3:18 PM

I have been in some churches where there was valid speaking in tongues, verified by interpretation, thus confirming it. I have also heard some, in prayer rooms, "quietly" praying in tongues and not drawing attention to themselves... I personally, would not question the validity in these types situations.

With that said, I have also been a witness to some, which could be classified as " A Resounding Gong", serving no purpose, but to draw attention to themselves. I classify them as "Mood Making Churches" and I would personally avoid them.

Some churches may operate this way, and I would caution people to be aware of this. It should always line up with God's word. Some have already given some good scriptures, so I won't add more.

These are just my honest opinions. Something to keep in mind in regards to languages, some of the old tribal Biblical languages would not be established as a "Known Language" of today. Think about some of the Amazon type tribes ( just an exp;). There are some tribes in existence today that there is no translation for their language. They use the method of showing things, pointing.

PastorD read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 4:18 PM

Another thought Sipedo, it's not just a Pentecostal thing. When I was in college, getting my Masters, there was a study/research thing going on, in regards to some Catholic churches and "Slaying In The Spirit". It is equivalent to falling out and thrashing on the floor and speaking in tongues. Might have been quite a trip to be assigned to that research group! lol

Cromagnonwoman read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 4:48 PM

Isn't the Pentecostal "Doctrine" based on Acts 2:38?
I attended a "holy roller" church a few times, with a former boyfriend, in the 90's. The preacher referred to Acts a lot.
Quite the experience.

Cromagnonwoman read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 4:53 PM

I forgot to mention they "spoke" in tongues and did interpretations as well as flop around on the floor, run around the church, jump on the pews, what ever they could do to show they had the spirit. It was a regular Cirque Du Soliel but free.
Funny thing was, the tongues "language" always sounded similar and the syllable content was usually the same. Very rhythmic.

northton read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 9:29 PM

I think I feel the holy ghost! Oh Mahatma Ghandi chile con carne shatta ma hallah balah!! Ooohhh mumbo jumboooo!!!! LOL

I saw a lot of that as a kid. It's amazing how people can repeat the same three "words" over and over yet the "translations" are so varied and complex! Nobody seemed to notice, too, that god had different words at different churches. Turns out "shatta ma halla hah" and "hatta ma tatta mahatta" both mean, "give us your donations"!

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 23, 2008 | 10:44 PM

I knew you'd chime in pastor norty.

Cro, The Acts 2:38 pentecostals typically are not trinitarians. The United Pentecostal Church is one such sect.

Other groups that are pentecostal, but do believe in the trinity are Assemblies of God, Pentecostal Church of God (Joplin, MO.), Church of God (Cleveland, TN), Church of God of Prophecy (Cleveland, TN) and the Foursquare Church. There are others, but these are the most prevalent.

The pentecostals you are referring to, I believe believe in Jesus Only as the Son of God, and the Holy Spirit/Ghost as separate as well as from God the Father. Three Gods, essentially.

northton, point well taken, I can recite some of the tongues that I heard growing up.

PastorD, sounds like you're on the right track, but forget about what you studied in college/seminary, it was most definitely skewed by nutty professors. I have a degree in Religious Studies and Religious Education, but I don't rely heavily on it. I had nutty professors too.

northton read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 5:43 AM

Thank you. Oh hakuna matata shambala hamas!!

Cromagnonwoman read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 7:02 AM

Mata wata shalla walla bing bang.
Translation; Send all donations over $100 dollars to a post office box to be supplied by Northton.
He will anoint a receipt, say a prayer and send it back to you, full of blessings.

Sipedo, Thank you for the clarification. You sure know your churchin.

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 9:53 AM

shay shay lay quiche shun duddy yum bubba gum diddy doo under da pee ton da lie may seek mandala

these are just a few of the words I remember. Always the same words from the same people. Always the same "interpreter" with a differnt interpretation.

some will say I am guilty of blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, to them I say, WAKE UP!

PastorD read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 10:10 AM

Sipedo, I definitely had some Kooks. The one's that aggravated me the most, were the one's who would push their own agenda. I call them the "Twist and Shout clan". I'm a bit unorthodox in my approach, if you checked out any of my blogs, you will notice.

I don't subscribe to scripture spewing and encourage dialogue instead. People expect others to know and understand every scripture... It's like expecting an infant to be able to digest a steak dinner!

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 2:45 PM

You bring up a good point. If you become a Christian, get saved, give your life to Christ, whatever you want to call it, and you don't STUDY, I have serious doubts about the commitment, however, how many churches are actually making disciples? Very few. Very Very Very few. Christians need to be discipled, not in church politics or doctrine, but in the written word of God.

If they are not, or they refuse, then I doubt their relationship with God is real.

afelton read my blog
Oct 24, 2008 | 8:48 PM

Sipedo, Pastor. Answer this question please for me.

Must a person speak in tongues in order to be saved?
I was taught that A lot in the Pentecostal church?
I told someone that you dont have to speak in tongues in order to be saved and they told me that if you dont speak in tongues then you dont have power. I guess you did answer that question already but I guess i am asking again.

barfar79 read my blog view my photos
Oct 24, 2008 | 9:44 PM

What does Acts 2:4 mean?
"And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost and began to speak with other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance"

sipedo read my blog view my photos
Oct 25, 2008 | 12:44 AM

afel. the answer to salvation is simple, believe upon the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved. another verse says that whosoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Tongues is not necessary for salvation. Not one scripture can be found to support such a claim. Second, you do not have to speak in tongues to have power, that also cannot be supported by any verse in the Bible. Both are cultish teachings, and are unfounded through the Bible.

barfar, if you read the entire context, we find that 120 men prayed in the upper room in Jerusalem, as instructed by Jesus. There were many in Jerusalem at that time that did not speak Greek, the language of the day. The disciples and the followers of Christ mostly spoke Greek. When they were fill with the Holy SPirit, the were filled with power to be witnesses. That power, for that period of time, was made evident to help spread the gospel. They became able to speak the wonders of God and the gospel of Christ in the many languages representative of the people in Jerusalem that day.

I hope that helps, but it's best to read if for yourself, and no just one verse. Read the book of Luke and then Acts, as they are companion books, both written by Luke.

PastorD read my blog view my photos
Oct 25, 2008 | 10:33 AM

Afelton, I agree with Sipedo. You do not have to speak in tongues to be saved. They were filled with the Holy Spirit, to receive power to witness and serve, as they were going to be spread across the world to preach the gospel to all the nations.

Not all Pentecostal churches preach that message about tongues being tied to salvation. I would not want them to be ALL thrown in the same basket. Some teach it, as a secondary issue of receiving their own personal "Prayer Language".
Because of that reason I personally would not throw them all into the "cult" category.

I also agree with Sipedo and teach my congregation to read entire chapters and sometimes books as part of your study. Many times, when people just "preach" one scripture verse they are using it out of context. Or they will piece a bunch of scriptures together to push or prove their own personal agenda.....

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sipedo

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